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Comments (266)

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  rdtsc
  Wherever their major offices are look for newspapers in the small towns nearby advertising for "Software developers for Oracle" all written in the tiniest print, right next to classified that sell used bikes, car parts and other stuff.- "Well, Uncle Sam, we looked so hard in US and nobody answered our job posts, we have to go to ... $othercountry to hire, there is no other way"
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  QGQBGdeZREunxLe
  It's always puzzled me that layoffs don't result in a temporary bar from using the H1B system like it does for filing PERMs with the DoL.
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  MrWiffles
  What I’m not clear on - how many of these H1B hires are subject to the EO that jacked up the fee to $100k per person? Assuming even just 100 of them were, that’s still ten million USD (assuming I didn’t visualize the zeroes in my head wrong…), and a really large fee to justify to the board if you’re otherwise paying “roughly the same” in salary. Productivity is going to basically break even anyway after a few years.This is why I’m wondering: did the EO get blocked, paused for judicial review or something? Is it even in effect?No intention to make this political, I’m legitimately curious about the status of the law and its actual applicability here. Supposed to be such a steep fine they literally couldn’t afford to do this - not with them already going cash flow negative to build out AI datacenters. So either it’s not applying (why?) or somehow they’re justifying one HUGE fee and somebody is floating them one astronomical loan - which again, why? Where’s the profit in taking that big a risk? Seems absolutely unhinged!We’re missing something here. Or, at least, I am.
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  reenorap
  The title is extremely deceitful. They filed H1Bs for 2025 and 2026, but not after or during the layoffs from last week.That’s like saying “Oracle hires tens of thousands and mass layoffs” (* hired during the pandemic)
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  moshegramovsky
  I don't understand why American workers would support this program at this scale. Furthermore, I believe universities and other similar researchy/affiliated non-profits are exempt from the hiring caps.I just cannot imagine executives at tech companies/body shops having any positive ethical motivations. More like "they'll do what we say without complaining or they'll go home". There's no way it's not just a hugely abusive to both pools of workers. The whole thing really feels like another example of the imbalance between labor and capital in the US.Who originally wanted H-1B/etc? Rich people with money and power? Of course!
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  BeetleB
  To all the folks here complaining that there is plenty of talent in the US to fill those roles:Honestly tell me: Would you ever apply to Oracle for a job?
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  mikert89
  Where did my standard of living go? Couldnt possibly have to do with imported labor working around the clock under the threat of being kicked out of the country
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  simianwords
  This whole H1B debacle tells me that people don't like it when employees are not fungible but this sentiment only exists selectively.The H1B i140 petition thing requires you to advertise the job before submitting the petition. How does this work if the employee is not fungible?
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  pm90
  Oracle is a large company. Many of those laid off were outside the US. This is a non-story.
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  hackthemack
  I find the topic of the morality or effectiveness of having a H-1B a little bit intractable to reason about rationally. Consider a simplified model of the system.You have 2 countries, C1 and C2.Scenario 1: C1 has enough demand for 100 tech jobs. C1 only has 50 qualified natives for 100 tech jobs.The wages of C1 go up because there is more demand than supply.Scenario 2: C1 has enough demand for 100 tech jobs. C1 only has 50 qualified natives for 100 tech jobs.Now you put in a H1-B visa program that will pay the same as the prevalent wage as a local native. C2 has enough candidates to fill the other 50 positions.The wages of C1 will NOT go up because now supply matches demand.Is Scenario 2 fair? Who gets to decide what fair is? Given the above system, I think I would argue that H1-B visa programs cause wage deflation in C1, even if it is filling jobs that would not be filled and even if the jobs paid the exact same as someone working in the native country.I am not dogmatic about that though. Willing to hear a counterpoint to scenario 2.
• dwa3592
  Misleading title.People who are wondering about $100k fee- it only applies if you are bringing people from overseas for this job; meaning if an immigrant is already in the country (eg: on a student visa), they don't have to pay $100k. It's just a visa change for them. There have also been murmurs about pay-to-play system, not sure how it works though.People who got pissed reading the title- majority of the visas sponsored were last year and not last week's layoffs.
• dgrin91
  What I don't get is, how does this economically make sense? Isn't there a 100k fee for h1bs now? So 3k h1bs would cost $300 Mil... Before you even start paying salary
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  cmiles8
  I would expect further H1B crackdowns coming. The $100k fee was just the start.
• smetannik
  Did oracle manage to circumvent 100k payment per H1B applicant?Also, why they need to do H1B instead of just outsourcing abroad?
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  pvelagal
  H1B is used to hire the best talent that gets paid big bucks as well as cheap talent that is paid less. Both are true. It depends on the company.I haven't seen Google or FB or Amazon or other top tech companies pay H1B any less. They get paid pretty well.But firing people (some might be on H1B too) and hiring H1B at the same time is meaningless.Btw, if you want to stop people from getting fired, J Powell needs to be fired. He is keeping interest rates high for any sort of hiring. These same companies hired like crazy during 0% interest rate environment.
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  lateforwork
  Keep in mind that employers have to pay $100,000 in visa fees (in addition to competitive salaries) for each H-1B visa. Clearly these immigrants are not undercutting US workers. It is $100K cheaper to hire a US worker.
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  thumbsup-_-
  Most of these would just be visa renewals. Though it wouldn’t be click bait enough to mention in article title
• e40
  I need to bookmark this so when maga nuts claim this never happens I have ready proof.
• anon
  undefined
• ojbyrne
  it would probably be useful to know how many of the current layoffs were people on H-1Bs.
• intensifier
  They both happened in separate timeline. Headline is misleading.
• emodendroket
  All of these companies are hiring constantly even as they do layoffs so this is an easy story to write every time there are layoffs.
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  sva_
  They have many departments, and are probably reducing some of them while increasing the workforce in others. The idea that they hire 'those damn foreigners' to push down wages is probably true to some degree, but not the whole story. I also don't believe the majority of these H1B are directly hired in other countries for which there is now a $100k fee, but rather people who studied in the US under F1 visa who are exempt from this rule.
• neoz
  Oracle laid off 12,000 people in India as well. What is this news on about? If all they wanted was cheap labor, why would they fire people in India and then also bring H-1B from overseas and pay them more?This is just ragebait.
• slau
  I hate Oracle as much as the next guy, but this seems like a nothingburger.Oracle didn’t file “thousands of H1Bs”. Oracle filed 2690 applications in FY2025 (Oct-Sep), and so far filed 436 in FY2026, according to the article.If anything, this would indicate that Oracle slowed down on hiring foreign workforce. Oct-Mar is half of Oracle’s fiscal year, but they only filed 16% of the H1B applications as in 2025? That seems in line with a hiring freeze and subsequent layoff.
• fooker
  This article is deliberately written in a way to aggravate people who do not understand how the visa process works.
• youknownothing
  This is unnecessarily incendiary, didn't get passed the first paragraph because this is so misleading:> Oracle [...] has filed thousands of petitions for H-1B visas in the past two fiscal years, even as it lays off thousands of American workersOracle is laying off workers of _all_ nationalities, not just Americans. I know people at Oracle with H1B visas that were laid off. Trying to paint it as if they're replacing Americans with foreigners is just unnecessary fear mongering.
• anon
  undefined
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  kstrauser
  No. Abso-f'ing-lutely not, no way, no how. You cannot force me to believe that the talent they're looking for isn't available here already.
• givemeethekeys
  Lawnmower strikes again.
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  alephnerd
  Meanwhile this March we saw 15k manufacturing jobs, 26k construction jobs, and 91k healthcare and education jobs added [0].Those are the voters that matter (unionized, geographically spread out, didn't price everyone else out via remote work) - not SWEs.[0] - https://www.ft.com/content/82c1795b-704a-4da3-82ec-2f9cd52de...
• jmyeet
  I personally think that doing a layoff of more than 2% of your workforce or 1000 people, whichever is high, should restrict you from filing for a work visa for a period of 3 years.Or you can buy your way out of that restriction by paying each laid off worker 3 years of wages.Pick one.
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  ericye16
  It's very sad how illiberal hackernews gets when it comes to H-1B visas and immigration in general. People will say that they are concerned about the welfare of H-1B holders because they can't leave their jobs but I've literally never heard anyone suggest an improvement (better portability, etc). Instead all anyone talks about is how bad it is that they have to compete against people from around the world. I think people are just afraid of a true meritocracy and maybe that's a bearish signal for the industry overall.
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  reducesuffering
  If you want to hire an H1B and claim there is no American to do that job, what about the 30k employees you just laid off? None of them can do the software engineering, sales, HR, etc. that a company like Oracle works on 99% of the time? It's quite schizophrenic for basic engineering companies like Oracle, Cisco, eBay, Paypal, etc. to claim there are no Americans to do the software engineering they require after they lay off thousands and there are millions of American software engineers looking for work.
• OrvalWintermute
  H1B is generally a giant scam of Labor Arbitrage
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  renewiltord
  All foreigners, pay attention to the people in this thread. They will often ask you to form unions with them. But what would such a union do? Well logically it would do what these people are asking them to do. And what do you see around you? Does it look like they're in favour of you. Do you think you'd be better off?Remember that the Hyundai workers in Georgia were deported at the best of the local union. Right now, foreigners are a large portion of this field's workforce. If you are to join with a union, you will rapidly find that it absorbs the remainder of the workforce through being "a union shop". You will rapidly find that such a union will expand to include all these people. And then they will ask for you to be deported. It wouldn't be the first time. The reason Chinese and Indians couldn't be citizens for a long time is because the predecessor to today's AFL-CIO lobbied to block that.Choose wisely. The danger is looking you right in the face and saying "I am the danger".
• frugalmail
  Sounds like Trump needs to add a $200k/yr premium to each H1B
• jrkfofjw
  Don't worry, Trump is in Ellison's pocket so this will go through.
• anon
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• civitas_
  [dead]
• jinglebell2025
  [flagged]
• timedude
  [flagged]
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  zombot
  The MAGA crowd will be ecstatic. They get fired while their president's buddy gets to hire new workers that are cheaper and more susceptible to extortion. Be careful what you vote for.
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  throwatdem12311
  Everyone that supports the H1-B program because they “can’t find talent” is my enemy.